Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

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CryptidWorks
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Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by CryptidWorks » Sun 12 Jan, 2020 5:35 am

I have a Ryzen 3600X for reference.

The Pentium MMX 233Mz works flawless but if go higher I start seeing more and slow-down and by the time I reach the K6/2 chips the system is barely usable because even booting to the desktop lags it down to 80% speed and games just tend to crash. Is this about normal performance or is there an issue on my end?

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SarahWalker
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by SarahWalker » Sun 12 Jan, 2020 8:09 am

That sounds normal.

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omarsis81
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by omarsis81 » Sun 12 Jan, 2020 1:50 pm

more emulated mhz demands more performance from your Ryzen CPU
do you have your 3600X at stock clocks or overclocked?

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CryptidWorks
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by CryptidWorks » Sun 12 Jan, 2020 10:42 pm

omarsis81 wrote:
Sun 12 Jan, 2020 1:50 pm
more emulated mhz demands more performance from your Ryzen CPU
do you have your 3600X at stock clocks or overclocked?
It's got PBO enabled and hits about 4.3Ghz single-core boost.

Ryzen chips really don't have overhead for OCing unless you're extremely lucky because unlike the FX line AMD pretty much has Zen pushed as far as it can go out of the box with boosting enabled instead of leaving headroom.

anabate
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by anabate » Mon 13 Jan, 2020 2:30 am

CryptidWorks wrote:
Sun 12 Jan, 2020 5:35 am
I have a Ryzen 3600X for reference.

The Pentium MMX 233Mz works flawless but if go higher I start seeing more and slow-down and by the time I reach the K6/2 chips the system is barely usable because even booting to the desktop lags it down to 80% speed and games just tend to crash. Is this about normal performance or is there an issue on my end?
Well CryptidWorks, if PCem were to have Intel emulation going past Pentium MMX 233, then it could possibly go like this...
[Socket 8] 440FX (could support Pentium Pro + Pentium II Overdrive)
Pentium Pro/150
Pentium Pro/166
Pentium Pro/180
Pentium Pro/200
Pentium II Overdrive/233
Pentium II Overdrive/266
Pentium II Overdrive/300
Pentium II Overdrive/333

[Super 8] 440BX (could support Pentium II, Celeron, and early Pentium III)
Pentium II/233
Pentium II/266
Pentium II/300
Pentium II/333
Pentium II/350
Pentium II/400
Pentium II/450
Pentium III/450
Pentium III/500
Pentium III/533
Pentium III/550
Celeron/266
Celeron/300
Celeron/333
Celeron/366
Celeron/400
Celeron/433
Celeron/466
Celeron/500
Celeron/533

Because I realized that AMD K-6 goes up to 550MHz.

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CryptidWorks
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by CryptidWorks » Mon 13 Jan, 2020 2:55 am

anabate wrote:
Mon 13 Jan, 2020 2:30 am
CryptidWorks wrote:
Sun 12 Jan, 2020 5:35 am
I have a Ryzen 3600X for reference.

The Pentium MMX 233Mz works flawless but if go higher I start seeing more and slow-down and by the time I reach the K6/2 chips the system is barely usable because even booting to the desktop lags it down to 80% speed and games just tend to crash. Is this about normal performance or is there an issue on my end?
Well CryptidWorks, if PCem were to have Intel emulation going past Pentium MMX 233, then it could possibly go like this...
It technically does because it has the faster mobile MMX chips that clock at 266Mhz and 300Mhz.

Xanarki
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by Xanarki » Mon 13 Jan, 2020 8:23 pm

Naturally, mobile processors are less powerful than a desktop processor. See image attached. In this case, under the Dhrystone test, the regular processors greatly outperform the mobiles, even though they're the same speed. Most of the different tests there has the regular Pentiums higher than the Mobile MMX. But there are a few instances where they were quite similar. Whetstone was the only test that Mobile MMX outperformed regular, but not by much. It all depends on the task at hand.
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SarahWalker
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by SarahWalker » Mon 13 Jan, 2020 8:53 pm

The desktop and mobile Pentium MMX chips are exactly the same performance-wise.

Xanarki
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by Xanarki » Mon 13 Jan, 2020 11:07 pm

Thanks for clarification. I'm no laptop or processor guru. I assumed that because of the power consumption differences, there would be more differences as well.

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CryptidWorks
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by CryptidWorks » Tue 14 Jan, 2020 1:30 am

Xanarki wrote:
Mon 13 Jan, 2020 8:23 pm
Naturally, mobile processors are less powerful than a desktop processor. See image attached. In this case, under the Dhrystone test, the regular processors greatly outperform the mobiles, even though they're the same speed. Most of the different tests there has the regular Pentiums higher than the Mobile MMX. But there are a few instances where they were quite similar. Whetstone was the only test that Mobile MMX outperformed regular, but not by much. It all depends on the task at hand.
In the actual hardware, yes because there's often factors that prevent them from sustaining their full clock speed like poor cooling in laptops.

In PCEM you're not dealing with those bottlenecks so clock-for-clock the desktop and mobile chips perform the same and 266Mhz and 300Mhz mobile chips are faster than the Desktop 233.

anabate
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by anabate » Sat 18 Jan, 2020 1:40 am

CryptidWorks wrote:
Mon 13 Jan, 2020 2:55 am
anabate wrote:
Mon 13 Jan, 2020 2:30 am
CryptidWorks wrote:
Sun 12 Jan, 2020 5:35 am
I have a Ryzen 3600X for reference.

The Pentium MMX 233Mz works flawless but if go higher I start seeing more and slow-down and by the time I reach the K6/2 chips the system is barely usable because even booting to the desktop lags it down to 80% speed and games just tend to crash. Is this about normal performance or is there an issue on my end?
Well CryptidWorks, if PCem were to have Intel emulation going past Pentium MMX 233, then it could possibly go like this...
It technically does because it has the faster mobile MMX chips that clock at 266Mhz and 300Mhz.
Well the processors I mentioned for going above Pentium 233 are outside the mobile MMX chips.

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leilei
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Re: Performance Degradation From Going Above a Pentium 233?

Post by leilei » Sat 18 Jan, 2020 1:54 am

Yes, emulating faster CPUs require faster CPUs. K6-2 has 3dnow extensions, which some drivers and games can use and require even more CPU to emulate (on top of the faster clocks)

Also the Windows desktop doesn't get along with dynarec so installing a HLT-spamming thing like "cooling tools" such as Rain will ease the execution (as Windows 9x did put CPUs on load at idle back then, hence the need for Rain). Ignore that "cooling an emulator haha no" smartass reply I got for suggesting this years ago because it works

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