[Request] Super Socket 7/AGP

Discussion of development and patch submission.
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gen_angry
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[Request] Super Socket 7/AGP

Post by gen_angry » Mon 13 Mar, 2017 10:35 pm

Hello,

With modern machines starting to reach the limits of what a P300-MMX can do, I am curious if there are any plans to eventually implement Super Socket 7/AGP/UDMA support?

ie: http://www.motherboard.cz/mb/epox/EP-58MVP3C-M.htm

Thank you

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leilei
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Re: [Request] Super Socket 7/AGP

Post by leilei » Mon 13 Mar, 2017 10:54 pm

For that to be truly useful there'd need to be AMD K6-2 emulation (Lots of SS7 boards were designed for that cpu in mind) and frankly I can't find any useful tech papers that would help with the timing of that, just a lot of papers about its differences vs AM486, K5 (also an enigma for timing) and Pentium. PCem getting any 3dnow! would mean WinChip2.

Also the VIA SS7 chipsets are notoriously buggy/unstable so debugging can be a case of Schrodinger's Bug. It probably doesn't help my VIA ss7 boards are also fried from over a decade ago.

(imo i'd rather see a 486VIP board before a SS7 board at this point)

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gen_angry
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Re: [Request] Super Socket 7/AGP

Post by gen_angry » Tue 14 Mar, 2017 5:10 am

Asus P5A or Gigabyte GA-5AX are two alternate boards. I've never owned an Ali board at any time so I cant really comment how it is.

As for processor tech info, would any of this may be of help? http://www.amd-k6.com/cpu-specs/

In either case, I had just been doing some spring cleaning and dug out my old K6-2 board/cpu (the specific epox board I linked above), which was the inspiration for this thread. I was more curious about the AGP aspect as it being the natural successor to Voodoo 2 level. As far as I'm aware; Slot 1 and SS7 were the earliest boards to support it and I believed SS7 would be an "easier path" due to mostly existing knowledge of Socket 7. I may be entirely wrong on this line of thought as my programming level is at the beginner/intermediate stage. Ya'll like gods compared to me, lol.

Thank you.

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SarahWalker
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Re: [Request] Super Socket 7/AGP

Post by SarahWalker » Tue 14 Mar, 2017 9:00 am

I do have timing info for the K6 family, the main problem with implementing it is that the out-of-order nature of the chip means any implementation will be a bit inaccurate. I am planning on looking at it for v13 though. 3DNow! is slightly trickier, as any real implementation would require adding support for it to the recompiler, which I'm less than keen on at present given that I'm planning on rewriting most of the recompiler for v14! I'll probably figure something out.

The main issue with emulating SS7 though, is that only one person has a machine fast enough to use it... ;)

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omarsis81
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Re: [Request] Super Socket 7/AGP

Post by omarsis81 » Tue 14 Mar, 2017 2:25 pm

For what I read on this page: ALi chipset had better performance but wasn't good at overclocking, the opposite holds true for the VIA MVP3
http://www.amd-k6.com/platform-hardware/

Since we don't care about overclocking, I'd go for the ALi and thus I agree with your suggestions gen_angry!
But, in the end... whichever is better documented and/or easier to program / emulate

On a side note: I bet we'll see the Klamath being in PCem first, since it would be easier to implement as it doesn't introduce any new register


PS: Sarah, I felt very happy reading your post. Nice to see you decided to rewrite the recompiler in the future!

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SarahWalker
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Re: [Request] Super Socket 7/AGP

Post by SarahWalker » Tue 14 Mar, 2017 6:26 pm

Klamath and other P6 architectures will be a pain to emulate properly, as out-of-order execution coupled with a pipeline twice as long as the K6 will make emulated timing a complete joke.

I don't really have a view on whether to emulate ALi Aladdin or VIA MVP3 first, I've used systems based on both in the past with no real issues, and I have datasheets for both. I'll probably end up tossing a coin to be honest...

Oh, and don't get too excited by the prospect of a recompiler rewrite, this is still some way off.

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